another one waiting for to be putt on report list.
Thanks !
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| Plinthus sp. - Curculionidae http://www.entomologiitaliani.net/public/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=240&t=54432 |
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| Autore: | zdeno [ 21/06/2014, 13:58 ] | ||
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Plinthus sp. - Curculionidae | ||
another one waiting for to be putt on report list. Thanks !
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| Autore: | ivo [ 21/06/2014, 15:03 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Curculionidae # 2 |
Plinthus sp. 
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| Autore: | ivo [ 21/06/2014, 15:22 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Curculionidae # 2 |
Probably Plinthus illotus. |
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| Autore: | zdeno [ 22/06/2014, 23:39 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Curculionidae # 2 |
Plinthus illotus Gyllenhal, 1834 Aedeagus matches.  
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| Autore: | dichotrachelus [ 23/06/2014, 14:27 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Plinthus illotus Gyllenhal, 1834 - Curculionidae |
Mh... if the Voratan pass is the one in southern Armenia, this is surely not Plinthus illotus. It is completely away from its range. This specimen also has the characters quite different from P. illotus. This is a complex group, and only the sclerites of the internal sac give information, not the general shape of the aedeagus. Massimo |
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| Autore: | zdeno [ 23/06/2014, 15:05 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Plinthus illotus Gyllenhal, 1834 - Curculionidae |
Ciao Massimo Well, I have done a small research from your work from 2007...compared aedeagus ( figure 12-18 ) under the microscope and even not clearly seen ( because I have destroyed the sack a bit ), it mostly matches P. illotus. Then distribution ( Figure 19 ) says only for illotus...if it is not any of these 4 mentioned in this work, is something else then living there ? I have specimens from Sevan Lake, just a few hundreds meters ( 2050 m alt. ) from it and those specimens from Voratan and Sevan Lake are identical - aedeagus. External characters vary a bit. Yes Voratan Pas is on the border with Nakhchivan.
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| Autore: | dichotrachelus [ 23/06/2014, 16:15 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Plinthus illotus Gyllenhal, 1834 - Curculionidae |
Interesting... Indeed there are at present no more species described from that region. But the whole genus should be revised again. I have several new species from the Caucasus and Turkey, and also Davidian has many new species. I saw a lot when I had visited him a few years ago. I guess that none of us has the time for working seriosuly at such a project at present, unfortunately!. The P. illotus group is extremely complex, but if you have examined the internal sac sclerites, and they look like the illustrations in the 2007 paper, then of course it's OK! Massimo |
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| Autore: | zdeno [ 23/06/2014, 16:30 ] |
| Oggetto del messaggio: | Re: Plinthus illotus Gyllenhal, 1834 - Curculionidae |
Massimo, if you want to study them, send me pm. They would not " warm up " very long in my hands anyway and better in your hands than anyone else...
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